Before saying anything, I want to make it clear that these are my opinions based on my experience. I have not been instructed or paid to write this and are not writing it for any financial reason or attempt to sway others opinions. I enjoy blogging and like having an online voice to discuss things which interest me and might be interesting to read.
Positive feedback from people about my blog shows that honesty is important and that is what I always try and do. I hope you enjoy it!
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This blog post is related to my visit to the John Packer showroom on Thurs 8th Aug 2024. It is somewhere I've wanted to visit before because I've had students ask what it is like there. I had been staying in Devon for a few days with my family and as the showroom is so close to the motorway junction, I thought it would be nice to visit.
Anyone can visit, but if you are planning to test some instruments, contact them first and check if this is possible. Sometimes there might be demo instruments available but at busy times there might not.
In the showroom, there are also mouthpieces and every type of instrument accessory you could ever need. The staff are lovely, very friendly and helpful. They also have skilled instrument technicians and offer a brilliant repair service.
I have met Tom Francombe a few times before at International Tuba and Euphonium Conferences. So it was really nice to see him again and have a good chat about instruments, education and family. "Thanks Tom for making me feel welcome!"
I think it is important to elaborate on my experience with John Packer, because my experience goes back a lot of years. I think this is important because consistency in sales, in quality and in customer service is something I have always found John Packer to have.
I first became aware of John Packer when I lived in Singapore (2011-2016). I worked for a company called Music360 and they are the main South East Asian dealer for both Sterling and John Packer. Being involved with them sparked my opportunity to endorse the Sterling Virtuoso euphonium and I still play the same euphonium that I did from back then.
Before moving to Singapore I played on a lovely UK made Besson Prestige and was very reluctant to play anything else. But working in Singapore gave me the opportunity to advise students on what instruments to purchase. Not just euphoniums, but all brass and I was keen to look into what instruments were the best value for money so I had a few options to recommend to people when they asked.
I am a firm believer that you must play an instrument that you love and that you believe in. Some players have swapped instrument brands more times than cars, which makes me think they were not playing it for the right reasons. However, maybe a deal giving an income to play a certain instrument is impossible to turn down and must be amazing, but for most players, that is a dream. The players who are in that situation are at the very top of the tree, getting there has required hard work and dedication, at a level similar to a famous sports person, so totally deserved. What one person achieved can be achieved by anyone, so always keep dreaming and following your goals!
As mentioned, in Singapore I also wanted to be able to recommend instruments to students or adults of any ability. Not everyone has the same budget either so I decided to do some research into brands and especially into the then emerging 'budget' or 'Chinese' versions of the top brands.
I first came across this idea when I learnt of another company in Singapore who had created a brand name and had a whole range of brass instruments made in China. They were aimed at students and more advanced players, sold with a higher price tag than they deserved and were poor in quality. I bet a lot of those instruments are still lying around in storage now, never to be used.
This has also been done by European companies such as John Packer, Wessex, Thomann and many others. You can literally make your own brand for anything in China, have a product made cheaply, sell it in your home country via Amazon for example and potentially make good money from it.
The problem I have, is when people are buying a product that is being marketed as professional or higher quality that it actually is. This, in my opinion, is a crime and why you must research what you are buying whether it is a euphonium or a watch. Some of the cheaper made instruments have inaccurate sizes of tubes and holes, poor quality plating that will tarnish very quickly unless polished, very bad intonation, vibrations or ringing noises, dead notes with no resonance and a whole host of other problems.
I visited the Shanghai Musikmesse in 2013. And were amazed by the varying quality of euphoniums on the trade stands.
You can slide through some of the images from that trip below.
On that trip, it was the first time I met some of the John Packer team and also the first time I played the JP374 Sterling model. It stood out a mile in comparison to all the other so called budget instruments. It even stood up well next to products from Besson and Yamaha which cost a lot more.
From looking at all the instruments on show, speaking with staff at each booth, some of whom lied through their teeth about the quality of their instruments and had euphoniums on show that I am certain had never even been played by a euphonium player, I decided, from the evidence, that the JP range was far superior. Not only did they offer a range of instruments, from real budget, basic beginner models to instruments that genuinely could bridge the gap from student to professional with ease but they did so at a fraction of the cost.
The thing with musical instruments and opinions, is that in some cases, you get talking to people who claim this and that, but actually cannot play to a high level or have limited performance experience. You also get musicians who could make any instrument sound amazing. The only way to really judge for yourself is by testing. Can the instrument you are playing or the one you plan to buy, aid you to make the sounds you want and need.
That's the question I ask myself and that is what made me decide that I would support Music360 in Singapore and recommend the JP products to anyone who asked me what they should purchase. If they had a massive budget then great, maybe get a top of the line Sterling Virtuoso but where possible always test different brands. If a lower budget, then JP had something to suit any wallet.
It was around that time that I did a JP374 review and video which is still on my Youtube channel. View it here.
Winding forward, I had more opportunities to test euphoniums at International Tuba and Euphonium Conferences in the USA. First thing I always found was, nothing suited me better than the Sterling I owned. There were other instruments I liked, The Besson Prestige for example is pure quality and has been for ages. But the JP Sterling always surprised me, because out of all the instruments on show, if I had to swap to something else and needed to spend my own money, that would be the one for me, mainly because of the amount of money I can save but still get an instrument that I know will still do everything I want.
The addition of a main tuning slide trigger on the JP374 just elevated the instrument into a zone which was and still is occupied by brands and models that cost over double the price tag. Apart from the top well know expensive brands, I don't think there is any other euphonium that can get near the JP374T for quality, value for money, after sales support and longevity of ownership.
The best thing about the trigger and similar to my custom made Sterling, the trigger is slightly lower. This allows the level to be pressed with the thumb comfortably and due to pipe work behind actually allows more distance without having to have the trigger lever protruding out from the instrument. It has a simple belly guard and simple screw to adjust the tuning slide, the same as on the Sterling Virtuoso, nothing can go wrong with it. No plastic belly guard which have been known to break and only adds extra weight.
At MWRTEC24 (read my blog about that trip here) I tested a lot of euphoniums and loved the JP374. Again, saying that or writing it here isn't rewarding me with anything. It is genuinely my favourite instrument out there based on value for money and the closest thing to what I currently use (Sterling Virtuoso).
So, up to current times, and my visit to the John Packer showroom in 2024.
I was keen to have a go on an up to date JP374 and write a blog about it. An instrument was available to test and there was also a 374T (with trigger) on display, that is the one in the picture above.
By complete chance, a customer's gold Besson Prestige had just been repaired, following some considerable damage and I said I would give the instrument a good play test, make sure it felt good before going back to the customer. So this meant, without any planning, I could actually do a side by side comparison of the JP374 and the latest Besson Prestige.
As mentioned, I played a Prestige for many years and loved it. But, I remember doing an ITEC euphonium competition and actually making the final round. The judges were four very highly respected euphonium players and the feedback from them was that my sound was too stuffy and lacked clarity.
This feedback was something that pushed me to move to the Sterling because of the ability to customise the instrument to suit my needs both ergonomically and musically. I didn't need the heaviest bell and biggest tone. I needed something that would give me clarity and projection. Actually something more similar to the JP374!
It is funny because even today, if you ask younger players who their idols are, they will say the current modern players who are around. If you ask those idols who their idols are then you might start getting names like John Clough, Lyndon Baglin and Trevor Groom. Or maybe even players like Morgan Griffiths and Michael Dodd. If you play euphonium and do not know these names then LOOK THEM UP!
Something all these players have in common was the ability to sing over the band without just playing loud, they could project and have absolute clarity at all times. This is something I cannot say is present to that extent with players today, because the instrument has almost out evolved the players.
The old imperial euphonium or early Besson Sovereign (round stamp) have a different tone to the current day Besson Prestige and similar, leaner and sweeter almost. Funny as well isn't it that Besson recently released a new model (BE969) which seems to almost go back to the old fashioned type of euphonium. An instrument that is lighter, which will be far easier to play for the student or average player and actually give those players a greater chance of reaching higher levels of playing ability.
Actually, and I haven't tried this new Besson, but I bet it is very similar to the JP374. Besson is a quality brand with a long history, and the need to revert back to something similar to their earliest model is amazing, a real eye opener. Maybe it is just clear that the big, heavy Prestige doesn't suit everyone.
So back to the JP374 Sterling. When I played this on my visit, the first thing I loved is that it is lighter to hold, yet feels as good quality as my Sterling. It will take all the air you can put in it and is very easy to play across the range. I didn't notice any strange vibrations or ringing noise, and it was easy to play loud and soft. I actually felt it was naturally better in tune than my Sterling. It has a bright, clear, punchy tone but also a warmth when played softly and gently. The silver plated version probably does this even more. I also love the lead pipe, it suits me perfectly and means I do not need to twist or feel my fingers are cramped.
I've played some Adams and Geneva euphoniums recently, and I can not get used to the more curved sort of lead pipe. But, we all have different bodies, arms and fingers and what suits one player might not be ideal for another.
The gold Prestige has a similar lead pipe to the JP and my own Sterling. Straighter and very comfortable to hold but yes, it is heavy. The sound is much darker and bigger. Maybe a silver plate version wouldn't be as dark? But, as I mentioned before, this can easily be a smoke screen. Many players want a darker tone and bigger sound, but this can just be a generic comment that people make. You can achieve this sound just by having a concept of the sound you want in your head, but having a massive fat, warm, dark sound can, as it did for me, cause you to lack clarity and projection.
The valves felt great on both JP374 and Prestige, slides moved as required and the valve tops were comfortable. I find it important not to have larger valve tops, smaller the better for my fingers anyway.
Think carefully when testing instruments. Have someone else whose ears you trust listen and also have your own instrument there as a comparison. Be aware of your gut instincts on what you subconsciously 'think' will be best for you, or what other people have told you, because it might lead you to buy an instrument that is not going to help your playing or even make you spend way more than you need to achieve what you want.
I didn't spend anytime messing around with tuning. I just played the instruments as I found them. I don't think that I would struggle at all with tuning on either instrument, even on a JP374 without a trigger. Sometimes a new instrument can completely throw you off with tuning, but neither of these seemed to do that. Again, that is a fairly normal expectation but when you think of the price difference, then it is amazing for the JP374.
For me, the JP374 and Besson Prestige stood up next to each other in every way. I am confident I could do whatever I need to do as a player on both. Again, this is amazing when you look at the price tags of both instruments. I do not know the specific material differences and are not interested in the individual specifications. I am sure a lot of these details are the reason for the big price difference. Both have the same size bell and the rest is about the sound and how it plays for me rather than a bunch of numbers and data.
Here is a video with me playing both, I don't think you will hear much, if any difference.
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Let me reiterate, I am not getting anything for being positive about the JP and I am not attempting to devalue the quality of the Prestige. Just think about it. If you are in the market for a car and have a budget that allows you to buy a BMW then great, do it. But if you have that budget and buying the BMW will make you need to be a bit careful with money over the coming years, personally I'd find a cheaper car.
If you struggle to put food on the table but own an instrument costing over £5000 then that makes no sense. A Kia will do the same job as a BMW, but you will have a lot of your budget remaining. We constantly hear about this cost of living crisis, how anyone can afford to spend up to £8000 on a new euphonium amazes me.
When the question comes down to whether you want to be seen holding a JP euphonium or a Besson then you are going in the wrong direction. You must think about what you need to achieve as a musician and not get distracted by anything else. A brass band adjudicator or average concert goer has no idea what brand of instrument you are playing on, they just know if you sound good or not.
Sterling as a brand has become lesser known and even a bit secretive. I hope that there will be some exciting news soon about Sterling by the way!! But it has filled a brilliant position in being a brand that offered excellent customisation options. The Adams brand has taken that position over now and taken it to a new level. The quality of Adams and sheer beauty of their instruments is amazing to see. I think, for some euphonium players, with a big budget, Adams deserves their money because it is probably the only brand that offers such different customisations now.
Geneva has made a big stamp on the brass world and boasts the ability to say their instruments are not made in China but there seems to still be some questions about the quality of the build. Some customisations are available as well which is attractive but that comes at a cost. Their euphoniums have huge potential and sound sublime in the right hands but perhaps need a little more time to settle into something that can be as trusted and reliable as Besson.
So, for every euphonium player that asks me for recommendations on which instrument to buy, I have to keep coming back to the JP374 because for the amount of money you save, the value for money you get and fact that for most, I don't think you would notice much difference in comparison with the top end brands, it rises to the top.
Few people will ever sit there and play test all the instruments in one price range. If you did that for the most expensive instruments, you would notice the overall quality is there, they are all brilliant in their own way because a lot of time and craftmanship has been put into their manufacture, often with help of experienced players.
If you play tested all the so called 'Chinese' instruments or instruments suitable for professionals at the lower price tag, those on eBay, Amazon, all the random brands that have been made without any input from professionals, then providing you have a good playing ability, you will notice the quality ranges massively from good to downright shocking. You are gambling with your money in this market.
The JP Sterling euphonium is brilliant. As is the JP Sterling tenor horn, tuba and baritone. There are other JP collaborations as well, for lots of other instruments. Browse their website to take a look - John Packer
Other players have also been impressed, check out these videos:
The John Packer JP374 Sterling Euphonium (youtube.com) - Review by Steve Miles
JP Sterling Euphonium Duet from Pearl Fishers (youtube.com) - Riki McDonnell
I hope this is interesting and helpful, and feel free to ask any questions in the comments below on here or YouTube. Please share any experiences you have had with the JP374, good or bad. I know that JP will welcome and act on any suitable criticism.
Thanks for reading. ❤
Mark Glover
10/08/24
I'm happy with my JP374TS which I bought in February 2022. A person in my band recently purchased a JP374TS to replace his band provided euphonium. Like me, he's also very happy with his new instrument. I believe a lot of golfers and photographers frequently upgrade their equipment with the hope to improve their game. Until I achieve Grade 8, I have no intention to spend on a more expensive european instrument.